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Thread: achieving darkest black

  1. #1
    Donor T. Schruda is on a distinguished road
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    achieving darkest black

    i have a pdf file with the background set up in 100%K-- and the client wants this to be the darkest possible black..

    im using EFI for this.

    i tried to replace K in the spotcolors with a darker CMYK RGB value then 000100 but it doesnt take it.. there must be a way i can replace the process color... ?

    as the profile for the file is isocoated.. the Lab value for black is not that deep.

    i tend to get best results with a photorealistic intend.

    do you have a different solution?

    what is the darkest black you can achieve on a semi gloss paper?.. to collect some samples.. thnx

  2. #2
    Moderator super silja will become famous soon enough super silja's Avatar
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    what is your lowest L?

    please tell us what is your lowest L?
    which media you use?
    what is your color setup? input profile output profile ( rendering intent is perceptual )
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  3. #3
    Donor T. Schruda is on a distinguished road
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    ok. i try to ask the question more precisely..

    1. what is the lowest Lab for a black that YOU achieve on a semi gloss paper ?

    2. input profile is isoCoated, like i said.. so i have a file isoCOATED v2, with k=100

    the client doesnt want me to proof this file to the ISO standard but wants it printed for a presentation so that K=100% will be a pitch dark black.

    i achieved this by telling EFI not to simulate anything but print perceptual with black ink only.. but then everything else in the document changes, too..

    in the spotchannels i see C M Y K. and for K = 0 0 0 100.. and tried to replace this with like 50 50 50 100-- but efi didnt take that. why? how can i replace a process color? i thought i could do this?

  4. #4
    Moderator super silja will become famous soon enough super silja's Avatar
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    black

    if you use isocoated for input , depest black is CIE L*a*b*=9,0,2
    please try to use full gamut setup.
    also try to use RGB, not CMYK color conversion. i am in hurry so i will post setup later
    i the meantime also in input bar click pd/pdf
    Working Color Space area, select RGB. (note: this is setup for efi xf rip)
    what is your L* values for black?
    efi 4245 and epson 4900 L=3
    Last edited by super silja; 02-21-2012 at 01:54 PM.
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  5. #5
    Junior Member tuser95 is on a distinguished road
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    I have a similar issue with printing a pdf file to a large format printer. In my case the blacks don't seem to be solid black - they seem more of CMY and not K - but not sure. When printed on offset with separations - it is fine. Should I try changing the printing colorspace to RGB??

  6. #6
    Junior Member tuser95 is on a distinguished road
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    I should add it was an EPS file not pdf.

  7. #7
    Junior Member shiv is on a distinguished road
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    Quote Originally Posted by T. Schruda View Post
    i have a pdf file with the background set up in 100%K-- and the client wants this to be the darkest possible black..

    im using EFI for this.

    i tried to replace K in the spotcolors with a darker CMYK RGB value then 000100 but it doesnt take it.. there must be a way i can replace the process color... ?

    as the profile for the file is isocoated.. the Lab value for black is not that deep.

    i tend to get best results with a photorealistic intend.

    do you have a different solution?

    what is the darkest black you can achieve on a semi gloss paper?.. to collect some samples.. thnx
    We use the combination - 100%Black+40%Cyan if the black can be a separate color then we may do double immpression

  8. #8
    Member print2011 will become famous soon enough
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    We use C-60 M-40 Y-40 K-100. We printed on the offset machine several tests and chosen this combination.
    In EFI u can use GRACoL or Euroscale coated profile.
    Result - deep black on the proof and offset.

  9. #9
    Donor Apa_Cska is on a distinguished road
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    define in Lab

    It can be define an unknown spot color as Lab, just use a special named extra spot color in the PDF, or eps, or ps. So u can use the darkest color, what the inkjet can produce on the given inkjet-media with the TAC of the linearization. Just drfine the unknown spot Lab 0,0,0.

    Ap

  10. #10
    Donor T. Schruda is on a distinguished road
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    thats a smart idea, too.. thanx APA

    i could also do that in EFI.. and just define K as Lab 0/0/0.. right. as in the document everything was in k=100

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  12. #11
    Junior Member Jonski is on a distinguished road
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    In our print environment we find that the best black is 100K 60C 40M 40Y

  13. #12
    Banned printhousepl is on a distinguished road
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    Wink rich black

    we use c20 m20 y20 k100 for rich black

  14. #13
    PRC Member r00tp will become famous soon enough
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    We use 60C 40M 40M 100K as well.

  15. #14
    Junior Member funnybone is on a distinguished road
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    My advice: create an empty RGB-file in PS, fill it with black (0,0,0) and convert it to ISOcoated V2.
    This gives you 87,78,64,93 with an ink coverage of 322%.

  16. #15
    epoch
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    Solid Blacks

    100 % K is not the most solid black, you can make.

    Try making a Rich black, or Cool black, or warm for that matter. Everyone has there own preferences and recipe's for these.

    Start with 100k, 40-70% in the other channels and adjust to taste. ( i always make test swatches and print those first).

    Oh on an EFI Rip you may want to set GCR to Source and turn off any black processing.

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